College Profs are a Clear and Present Danger to American democracy

102 posts / 0 new
Last post
Ugenetoo
Offline
Last seen: 10 hours 39 min ago
Joined: 08/05/2011 - 12:32pm
Greenee

Greenee
Intelligence does not always convey common sense.

anonymous_coward
Offline
Last seen: 24 min 11 sec ago
Joined: 10/21/2016 - 12:18pm
@Toolsmith: "So, in order to

@Toolsmith: "So, in order to get an education, a student is required to immerse themselves in an environment where any ideas other than those politically approved by the far left are viciously ridiculed. That price was too high in the 1980s. I can't imagine how bad it is now."

The article refers to liberal arts colleges. There are other very good learning institutions besides liberal arts colleges.

anonymous_coward
Offline
Last seen: 24 min 11 sec ago
Joined: 10/21/2016 - 12:18pm
@Economike: "Redistributed

@Economike: "Redistributed funding will have near-zero effect."

Again, you're taking Caplan's findings to an absurd conclusion... including extending it into high school. Did he actually do any research on differing high schools?

Economike
Online
Last seen: 13 min 26 sec ago
Joined: 11/28/2006 - 9:09am
anon -

anon -

You are correct that I am taking Caplan's thesis to an absurd conclusion. He's not writing about K-12.

I don't think, though, that a null hypothesis of K-12 public schooling is absurd.

Consider:

To the extent that schools are effective in educating children, we should expect significant variance between the intellectual abilities of parents and children. If there's little or no measurable difference, then we may conclude that schools have little or no effect on improving intellectual abilities of children. Why or why not?

anonymous_coward
Offline
Last seen: 24 min 11 sec ago
Joined: 10/21/2016 - 12:18pm
@Economike: "To the extent

@Economike: "To the extent that schools are effective in educating children, we should expect significant variance between the intellectual abilities of parents and children. If there's little or no measurable difference, then we may conclude that schools have little or no effect on improving intellectual abilities of children. Why or why not?"

Lol ok... I'll bite. I am guessing you are potentially referring to knowledge accumulation (e.g. "Are you smarter than a 5th grader?").

If this is the case, first off, those games are rigged (they give the kids the answers beforehand). But, the point of why do we learn so much information in school that we either do not use or forget is a valid one. (Or, more to the point, should we question the curriculum in schools?)

I'll agree and disagree with this one. (Apologies if I'm putting words in your mouth, but I hope I'm getting where you're going.)

Disagree: There is a very clear increasing level of quality of writing that starts low when you first learn to read, and increases until you stop going to school. The ability to use correct spelling, then later correct grammar, and then nuanced style, and all the while being able to effectively communicate and organize ideas gets better all the way through college (and beyond, if you are a professional writer).

Like a musical instrument or a sport, you can see exactly where the person stopped actively learning about writing. A high school student writes better than a middle school student; a college student writes better than a high school student, and a white collar adult (who writes documents and emails all day long) writes better than a high school student.

Agree: Conversely, I think the way we organize teaching math is pretty incorrect. You force students that aren't going into science (where you need advanced math tools and tricks) to learn tools and tricks they will never use. Why would someone that is going to become an accountant (or even an economist) need to know integration by parts?

You could easily teach the basic concepts of calculus to all students, which is an important fundamental concept in life, without getting into the weeds of every integration technique for all of the trig functions. Then, you backload the really difficult stuff into a final year for students going into math and sciences.

Economike
Online
Last seen: 13 min 26 sec ago
Joined: 11/28/2006 - 9:09am
I should have clearer.

I should have been clearer.

If schools are effective in educating children, then shouldn't we expect children of less educated parents to emerge from public schools with the same abilities as the children of more educated parents? Or, at least, schooling would trend toward reducing the status quo ante gap between them?

If children emerge mostly at the same relative level of ability as their own parents, then mightn't we conclude that public schooling fails at enhancing opportunity for the less-affluent?

Melvin Udall
Offline
Last seen: 5 hours 22 min ago
Joined: 05/01/2002 - 12:01am
Priorities are straight at

Priorities are straight at our public schools:

BJHS Pride Week

I don't know when the puberty line is crossed these days, but my JHS days were grades 7, 8, and 9. These days, it's 6, 7, and 8.

And suicide and mental health are issues of concern:

http://www.brunswick.k12.me.us/suicide-prevention-and-mental-health-resources/

Note the welcome passage at the top of this page.

Shouldn't a giant "what has changed" analysis be under way to discover why such pathologies, relatively unknown just decades ago, are now front and center? And who bears the responsibility for it?

Watcher
Offline
Last seen: 1 week 2 days ago
Joined: 03/23/2008 - 12:32pm
Video by Prager is right on.

Video by Prager is right on. The speaker says that the people who are teaching our children are dangerous. They are Socialist/Marxists whose only goal is to bring America down...and they are passing that idea on the the students.

Teaching Treason

anonymous_coward
Offline
Last seen: 24 min 11 sec ago
Joined: 10/21/2016 - 12:18pm
@Economike: "If schools are

@Economike: "If schools are effective in educating children, then shouldn't we expect children of less educated parents to emerge from public schools with the same abilities as the children of more educated parents? Or, at least, schooling would trend toward reducing the status quo ante gap between them?"

Not necessarily, since it's possible that children of more educated parents are smarter/better at school, take more advanced classes, etc.

But, it should absolutely follow that children that go to school are more educated than those that do not go to school. If you're measuring the efficacy of school, then you have to randomly sample a set of children that do not go to school vs. those who do. (Which is obviously difficult since everyone has to go to school.)

anonymous_coward
Offline
Last seen: 24 min 11 sec ago
Joined: 10/21/2016 - 12:18pm
@Watcher: "Video by Prager is

@Watcher: "Video by Prager is right on. The speaker says that the people who are teaching our children are dangerous. They are Socialist/Marxists whose only goal is to bring America down...and they are passing that idea on the the students."

That video is retarded demagoguery. But, it's what you want to hear, so that's why it gets views/clicks.

BTW Economike - this video is the kind of thing I was referring to when I was saying that there is a growing conservative trend against education.

Ugenetoo
Offline
Last seen: 10 hours 39 min ago
Joined: 08/05/2011 - 12:32pm
There is a growing

There is a growing conservative trend against education because there is a huge and growing war by education against conservativism.

anonymous_coward
Offline
Last seen: 24 min 11 sec ago
Joined: 10/21/2016 - 12:18pm
@UGenetoo: "There is a

@UGenetoo: "There is a growing conservative trend against education because there is a huge and growing war by education against conservativism."

If there is a war on conservatism by certain institutions, the answer is to establish alternative conservative institutions (or to steer those institutions back towards the center), not to steer your tribe clear of education entirely.

expat
Offline
Last seen: 10 hours 14 min ago
Joined: 02/11/2014 - 5:39am
The reason there are so few

The reason there are so few conservative institutions or teachers is because there are so few conservatives who have the intellectual capacity to effectively teach. It's so much easier to see themselves as victims rather than losers.

Melvin Udall
Offline
Last seen: 5 hours 22 min ago
Joined: 05/01/2002 - 12:01am
"Those who can't do teach.

"Those who can't do teach. Those who can't teach write books."

Did you ever wonder why public school teachers are required to have teaching credentials/certification, but colleges require no such things for their faculty?

Toolsmith
Offline
Last seen: 44 min 27 sec ago
Joined: 07/14/2016 - 11:22am
Certainly not against

Certainly not against education, but I am against indoctrination masquerading as education.

Learning is a lifetime occupation. It's not supposed to stop when school ends, or be limited to school, but that's common.

Too many stop learning when they are rendered ineducable. Many believe they know everything already.

Being told what to think is not education.

It's been a long time since new institutions of learning were founded in large numbers, but perhaps that's just what's needed. And maybe this doesn't require the huge investment in bricks & mortar which was previously the case.

expat
Offline
Last seen: 10 hours 14 min ago
Joined: 02/11/2014 - 5:39am
It's not supposed to stop

It's not supposed to stop when school ends, or be limited to school, but that's common.

Straw man argument. What's you theme song? If I only had a brain?

Toolsmith
Offline
Last seen: 44 min 27 sec ago
Joined: 07/14/2016 - 11:22am
What is this - Debate club?

What is this - Debate club? Who made you rule master? Is everything I say supposed to be an argument?

It's my opinion, based on a lifetime of watching people do silly stuff over and over again. It's not scientific, it's an opinion. Based on the skill level of new coworkers coming out of college, I certainly can't say anything is getting better. I can't PROVE IT, but that's my opinion. I certainly had better skills when I was that age, and I've learned a huge amount since then.

Melvin Udall
Offline
Last seen: 5 hours 22 min ago
Joined: 05/01/2002 - 12:01am
get out much?

get out much?

Toolsmith
Offline
Last seen: 44 min 27 sec ago
Joined: 07/14/2016 - 11:22am
"The reason there are so few

"The reason there are so few conservative institutions or teachers is because there are so few conservatives who have the intellectual capacity to effectively teach. It's so much easier to see themselves as victims rather than losers."

And this isn't a Strawman, right? Of course not. It's an Ad Hominem attack AND a Strawman. Or is that a Sweeping Generalization? It's so hard to keep track of all the fallacious arguments being used here, especially by those complaining about it.

Melvin Udall
Offline
Last seen: 5 hours 22 min ago
Joined: 05/01/2002 - 12:01am
Is there a difference between

Is there a difference between "teach" and "indoctrinate?"

What is the latest....more than 50% of our recent graduates would prefer living under socialism?

Man....that sure am some fine teaching going on. Not to mention being unsure of your gender, and even more exciting, being able to change it at will.

Toolsmith
Offline
Last seen: 44 min 27 sec ago
Joined: 07/14/2016 - 11:22am
"Not to mention being unsure

"Not to mention being unsure of your gender, and even more exciting, being able to change it at will."

I often wonder what the old East Germans must think of this. They tried everything to win with their women at the Olympics, destroying the bodies of who knows how many young women with steroids. If they were trying now, they could just use MEN. Unfortunately, I think it's likely we'll see this before long...

Ugenetoo
Offline
Last seen: 10 hours 39 min ago
Joined: 08/05/2011 - 12:32pm
The reason there are so few

The reason there are so few conservative institutions or teachers is because there are so few conservatives who have the intellectual capacity to effectively teach. It's so much easier to see themselves as victims rather than losers

I love this passage from the liberal playbook.
It is what helped Hillary lose, so badly, a supposedly fixed election. LOLOLOLOL

MAGA

Economike
Online
Last seen: 13 min 26 sec ago
Joined: 11/28/2006 - 9:09am
anonymous coward writes -

anonymous coward writes -

Not necessarily, since it's possible that children of more educated parents are smarter/better at school, take more advanced classes, etc.

Of course, we can imagine why kids of smarter parents do better in school, but that's not the puzzle. If public schools are effective, then the achievement gap between high income and low income kids would narrow measurably. If it doesn't, then public schools don't improve intergenerational social outcomes. That is, if public schools really educate, kids from less educated parents ought to catch up - at least partly - with the kids from more educated households. Right?

But, it should absolutely follow that children that go to school are more educated than those that do not go to school. If you're measuring the efficacy of school, then you have to randomly sample a set of children that do not go to school vs. those who do. (Which is obviously difficult since everyone has to go to school.)

Of course, some sort of schooling is better than none at all. Again, that's not my question. Is mandatory and (de facto) segregated public schooling more effective than numerous other possiblitites? While we can't conduct a controlled experiment, how about the efficacy of - just for one example - home schooling?

Economike
Online
Last seen: 13 min 26 sec ago
Joined: 11/28/2006 - 9:09am
The reason there are so few

The reason there are so few conservative institutions or teachers is because there are so few conservatives who have the intellectual capacity to effectively teach. It's so much easier to see themselves as victims rather than losers.

This biased lunacy bears repeating. Why bother to comment when it speaks for itself?

Ugenetoo
Offline
Last seen: 10 hours 39 min ago
Joined: 08/05/2011 - 12:32pm
Yup!

Yup!
It's puzzling as to why AC even bothers to post amoungst us idiots.
Slumming, perhaps?

Economike
Online
Last seen: 13 min 26 sec ago
Joined: 11/28/2006 - 9:09am
I suspect, Ugenetoo, you're

I suspect, Ugenetoo, you're referring to my quotation from expat's post, not anonymous_coward's.

expat
Offline
Last seen: 10 hours 14 min ago
Joined: 02/11/2014 - 5:39am
Try to keep up Ugenetoo. I

Try to keep up Ugenetoo. I posted the rude remark, not AC. He's actually not a troll. Not that you would recognize that.

Toolsmith
Offline
Last seen: 44 min 27 sec ago
Joined: 07/14/2016 - 11:22am
John Stossel on the state of

John Stossel on the state of affairs in Canada, and one who isn't giving in. "Resistance" is taken, so what do we call it?

https://patriotpost.us/opinion/56511-patriarchy-defender

Matt
Offline
Last seen: 2 hours 55 min ago
Joined: 01/21/2008 - 6:21pm
Here’s where Myopic Mike

Here’s where Myopic Mike suggests that ugenetoo apologize to ac.

Ugenetoo
Offline
Last seen: 10 hours 39 min ago
Joined: 08/05/2011 - 12:32pm
Sorry AC.

Sorry AC.
My bad.
I should have known you wouldn't state something as ignorant as that.

Pages

Log in to post comments