The 2016 Election

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pmconusa
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The 2016 Election

One man one vote has been a long standing principle of elected government and the Supreme Court has weighed in on the matter, declaring States must district themselves so that the populations of each district is nearly equal. The political parties have for decades tried to draw these districts to their own advantage, a concept called Gerrymandering. The courts have declared this unlawful and when challenged the states have had to come up a resolution that satisfies the court.

On the national level this is not the case. When concocting the means to elect the President and Vice President the framers devised the Electoral College system where each State gets votes equal to the number of Senators and Representatives. This system favors states with larger populations that tend to be in favor of a government regulated economy as opposed to a free market. It worked well for two elections, 1790 and 1794 but all of a sudden Thomas Jefferson, a state’s righter and Arron Burr, a Federalist tied. A compromise was reached where Jefferson would ascend to the Presidency and Burr to the Vice Presidency but the Constitution would be amended to tie the two posts together in terms of party instead of the one with the most votes getting the Presidency and the second place finisher the Vice Presidency.

The damage to free markets had already been accomplished with the tariff acts passed by the Congress in 1790 and 1791 but the President still held the veto over the acts of Congress he deemed unconstitutional. The backers of a government regulated economy still held sway in the House of Representatives and would increase their power in every Congress since. The Power of the President, already limited by the power of the Congress to override a veto was further emasculated when John Marshall declared it was the Supreme Court who decided constitutionality. The free market supporters who dominated the Senate for decades were finally stripped of their power by the 17th Amendment that called for election of Senators by popular vote.

The idiosyncrasies of the Electoral College have evidenced themselves in five Presidential elections, the last of which was the latest. It turned out as it has in the past, the loser got more popular votes than the winner, which was the intent of the system in the first place and that was to insure the popular vote was meaningless, because some constituencies, such as the big city regulated economy supporter votes count for more than those of the free marketers. They have done the same thing with the tax code, which favors those in the regulated market.

The actual popular vote in the last election was Clinton 65,853,516 to Trump’s 62,984,825. The Electoral College vote was 302 for Trump and 207 for Clinton. It takes a majority of 256 to win. If you tally up the top eleven states with enough to win they add up to 267. Clinton garnered 117 and Trump 150.

A most interesting facet of how the two parties have determined the distribution of these votes within the state. With the exception of Maine, all of the electoral votes go to the candidate with a majority of the popular vote. It means that the winner need get only one more vote than his opponent to take the whole shebang. That again favors the city vote that leans toward a regulated economy. As it is now impossible to go back to a free market economy and the Republicans are now doomed if they threaten the welfare state supported by a regulated economy, it really makes no difference who is elected, the result is only the speed at which we will reach economic disaster. That is before the turn of the century when the population exceeds the country’s food production. (kcals to Bruce and Mel)

An interest exercise reveals that if the winner of the state’s electoral votes won by merely 1 popular vote, Trump would have won 62,773,000 to 62,657,000. This doesn’t tally to the totals because I have ignored the votes for other candidates as well as take away excess votes from the winner in each state.

Prior to the current era there were three elections in which the popular vote getter did not win. They were J.Q. Adams versus A. Jackson, S. Tilden versus R. Hayes and B. Harrison versus G. Cleveland. I can state categorically that the Russians had nothing to with either of these as the Soviet Union did not exist at the time.

Hillary’s biggest mistake was adding an avowed Socialist and not even a member of the party to share the primary ticket. I believe it was to make appear Hillary wasn’t being anointed by the party. Sanders turned out in many instances to be more popular to the Democrat base than Hillary and it showed in quite a few primaries until Hillary began her behind the scenes campaign against him. That Hillary was still popular, despite the release of damaging charges of corruption against her, not by the Russians but by WikiLeaks, shows in the popular vote that, in my opinion, would have been considerably higher and probably enough to defeat Trump had she not lost the support of those who preferred Bernie Sanders.

Looking for significant dirt on the Russians as responsible for the Democrat debacle can be quickly set aside by asking yourself what did they do and how did they do it to achieve a result where under any normal democratic one man one vote system Hillary won, but didn’t. If you think the American government doesn’t interfere in a more active way in other country’s elections I give you Mohammed Karzai.

Melvin Udall
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To quote Dr. Owen Pincus,

To quote Dr. Owen Pincus, "need I say more?"

Toolsmith
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It should be publicly

It should be publicly suggested that doing things Maine's way would be more democratic. In fact, it should go further and assign ALL Electoral College votes by district not just some of them - no more statewide "winner by one vote" bonus. That way, Trump wouldn't have gotten all the Electoral College votes from Pennsylvania, for example.

This is, of course, the perfect Trojan Horse. If the Dems go for it, they'll lose far more votes in just California than they'll gain anywhere else. Overall, that district map showing Dem votes only in coastal cities and a few enclaves would become the electoral map too...

pmconusa
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Toolsmith: Perhaps I didn't

Toolsmith: Perhaps I didn't make my point clear. When Trump avowed he would not touch Social Security and said he would scrap Obamacare he garnered the support of those who depend on Social Security for their survival. Avowing to increase military spending did the same for those whose livelihood depends on the military industrial complex. Supporting free education at all levels was the mantra of Bernie Sanders and not Hillary Clinton to the students who are or would be in hoc so they didn't have a candidate When he made these promises the Democrats no longer had a devil to accuse they would take away what they had given you. Republicans have had to become like the old Democrats because freedom for the individual has already been lost and the well organized and better disciplined Democrats have nothing more that they can offer for "free" and have had to go so far to the left they are losing many of their own supporters.

Your government, be it dominated by Republicans or Democrats finds itself on a raft on a river going with the flow toward the falls. Both Republicans and Democrats are paddling in the wrong direction but at different speeds. It is the nature of the economic system we have chosen to fuel our economy, failing to realize that the only thing that makes us equal is our requirement for fuel(food and its energy value). You can now actually calculate with reasonable accuracy when our country will reach a point where consumption equals production. That point has been reached in many countries already and the evidence is as plain as the nose on your face, civil war and mass migration. When you see the storm clouds on the horizon it is only a question of time when the rain starts to fall.

Your fellow AMGs Bruce and Mel say this isn't so but have yet to prove me wrong because they can't. Doom and gloom is not fully here yet but it is already on our doorstep. If it were not for government charity, 45 million or more Americans could not buy food, They already cannot afford shelter and their numbers are growing daily, accelerated by the inclusion of refugees from their own country's plight. Just think what it would be like if we were bordered by India and Pakistan.

I believe Bruce was a government employee and his pension is protected by the governments ability to tax today's workers to pay his pension to which he contributed little. Mel on the other hand was employed by the military industrial complex that is also protected by the government, insuring that money will be available to pay his company pension.

None of us is old enough to have experienced the rampant inflation that existed in Germany after World War I. Germany was encumbered by reparation payments, mainly England and France. They were punitive, in that the money Germany owed was more than would have been required to replace the damage caused by the War. England for example suffered little physical damage except loss of life and no amount of money could restore life. When the government attempted to tax the population to pay for it they were kicked out of office so in order to sustain the regime they resorted to printing money while at the same time the treasury was being forced to reduce their gold stocks to pay the reparations. The result was rampant inflation of the currency in relation to the currencies of their trading partners which was actually being enhanced by the influx of "free" gold.

This inflation was halted by the government of none other than Adolph Hitler who immediately reneged on the debt but found the country his government headed, virtually bankrupt. He couldn't raise the money from the usual sources, the British and French banks who now found themselves without their reparation payment. Where did he turn? American banks. Yes, it was the bonds issued by the German government that financed the German economic revival and made possible the rise of Nazism (fascism) and Hitler's ultimate ambitions of domination in Europe.

Bruce Libby
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Once again in your

Once again in your clulessness you speak things you do not know about.
You donot know how mucvh I contributed to my pension . You could find that out but your to busy
spewing your opinions.

My only hope is you enjoy your misery ,daily ration of ALPO and knowing you also contribute to my pension, causes you all sorts of gastric distress !

Jasper
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Ah Brucie, you petty, petty

Ah Brucie, you petty, petty little man. Thanks to you, Mel and a few others, AMG has devolved into a forum with half-a-dozen regular contributors. It's so predictable now it's not even entertaining. Sad.

Bruce Libby
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Smegma not because of us but

Smegma not because of us but because of those who had a fit over Dutson buying it,thank Fish,and then the expulsion of his holiness and from the Bunker.
Anyone who left could have stayed and offered input. Instead of doing drive buys wth the requisite digs and insults etc.etc..
Of course this in your opinion has been what you so wanted.
Anyone who disagrees with me can post and offer an opposing view. Why don't you do so without the profanity and insults. I have actually agreed with you times when you have bothered to offer anything sans the filth.

Melvin Udall
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pmcon: It's not what you don

pmcon: It's not what you don't know, but what you do know that is wrong, to borrow the words of someone more famous than me, but less famous than you...at least in your own mind.

Your habit of taking a wisp and turning it into confirmation of your genius reveals so much about the fantasies you employ to get your daily dose of validation. Can't you just find it in a pill and save yourself all the time you spend on the soapbox?

Jasper
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Mel, you are the one who

Mel, you are the one who needs a pill to control your flatulence.

johnw
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But jasper you ARE a regular

But jasper you ARE a regular contributor.........go ahead hit that Tarbaby......

pmconusa
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Unfortunately Bruce I do know

Unfortunately Bruce I do know exactly how much you may have contributed to your state employee pension, if indeed you collect one but I do know that if you collect a pension, you, like millions of Social Security recipients have never contributed what you will collect. State Legislators are paid their expenses and that is it, because the majority of them have jobs that do not require their full time to pursue, such as the law. However, if the just happen to be appointed to a government position, which usually pays a rather high salary compared to the private sector, their time serving the legislature counts toward their retirement benefit. It is the reason we have so many high position that require appointment and which turn over with regularity. For example, the state pension is the average of the highest three years salary times 2% times the years of service. A legislator who spent 20 years in the legislature spent even one year in state employment at say $100,000 per year, he would be entitled to a pension of $40,000 per year plus a big contribution to his health insurance of 45%. A nice carrot but it comes at the price of towing the party line, dictated by the leadership. But all at the expense of the taxpayers.

Bruce Libby
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WTF

WTF

P.S. Unfortunately you do not know. but even more unfortunate, is the fact that you could find out ,but for a smart person like yourself you are incapable to do so. But typically you take it upon yourself to educate me on the pension system which I was in for 40 years.

johnw
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MaineOpengov....the gateway

MaineOpencheckbook..the gateway to that info pmconusa.... they’ve made it a little torturous to get to the info but if you are persistent it’s all there...
There are some pretty substantial pensions out there.....http://opencheckbook.maine.gov/

Bruce Libby
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Thank you johnw. I was going

Thank you johnw. I was going to but thought best of it.
One would think a member since 2000 and all the threads about MaineOpen.....it was self evident.

Melvin Udall
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"State Legislators are paid

"State Legislators are paid their expenses and that is it, because the majority of them have jobs that do not require their full time to pursue, such as the law."

Another example of how much our all-knowing expert, at least in his mind, ACTUALLY knows.

pmconusa
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John: Why do you think they

John: Why do you think they make it so difficult to find out? Could it be they really don't want you to know?

Melvin Udall
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Hey, WTF? I thought you

Hey, WTF? I thought you would dutifully reply to anyone who questions your assertions?

Is that only if you aren't wrong?

Oh....I forgot rule 2. My bad.

Bruce Libby
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Clue:

Clue:
It is a private website not a public entity .

Bruce Libby
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Right Mel.

Right Mel.
But it appears johnw has helped in getting YKW to show his paranoia about conspiracies .

Melvin Udall
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Well, apparently our KIA only

Well, apparently our KIA only responds to challenges to his delivered wisdom on the 32nd of each month.

So much for "if you don't believe me...."

Melvin Udall
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Still waiting; wish I had a

Still waiting; wish I had a good book to help pass the time.

Melvin Udall
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STILL WAITING, 24 hours later

STILL WAITING, 24 hours later than last post. It appears KNW has gone AWOL on his promises.

Melvin Udall
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Still waiting another 24

Still waiting another 24 hours later!

YKW posted this today on another thread:

If you post anything that opposes or is contrary to the Progressive view you get WTF but no defense of the Progressive position because it is indefensible. It is no wonder why people do not want to side with the opposition. I think those folks ae still out there but want to avoid the WTF folks because it is a losing cause. On this blog they cannot talk over them like they can in a public forum. Why do you think only conservatives or opposing thinkers are exposed to this kind of conduct? On this blog they can't talk over you so they use ridicule and invective to dissuade your questioning their position. It is why I try to ignore it and refuse to respond to their comments on my post when all they can say is WTF or call you smegma.. They do not wish debate. What they want is silence. Unfortunately I won't be silenced and am thick skinned enough to ignore their inane behavior. Have you ever noticed that the smallest people seem to have the loudest voices.

Once again, Captain Clueless emphasizes his total absence of self-awareness, especially as it relates to WTF. And that he is reduced to calling anyone who challenges him a "progressive" as a way to dismiss them out of hand rather than face reality. He does not wish to debate any challenge to his stone tablets of wisdom and truth, as evidenced in this thread. He cannot admit his own fallibility. And is genetically unable to correct the record when he is caught with his genius pants down.

Thick skinned? Thick-brained should be added to that. His utter inability to pick up on cues of all sorts goes along with his narrative attitude, which has only one tone. He is completely lacking in receptors, other than those that say "another fool is knocking at the door."

The only thing he responds to is fawning admiration and validation, and his constant lugubrious and palaverous treatises on mostly obvious points demonstrate how much he craves them.

Have you ever noticed how the smallest people write the longest opening posts?

On a related note, I remember two useful quips from my college days:

"If it don't go, chrome it."

"Them that talks about it most gets it the least."

Melvin Udall
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STILL WAITING, oh smartest

STILL WAITING, oh smartest person in the world, except for Obama and Hillary, of course.

In case you forgot, the question I put forward was for you to corroborate this assertion of yours:

"State Legislators are paid their expenses and that is it, because the majority of them have jobs that do not require their full time to pursue, such as the law."

You see, if you can't get minor details like this, easily researched, correct, why should we take anything else you say, like global wheat consumption, etc, as gospel fact?

pmconusa
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Mel: Thanks for correcting

Mel: Thanks for correcting me. Without researching fully I incorrectly assumed Legislator pay was like it was when I lived in New Hampshire, expenses only. Notwithstanding that error, the State pension system is very much like the government's Social Security Ponzi scheme in that it pays more than people pay in but unlike Social Security it is even more lucrative in that it requires the state employee to pay in only a small portion of what is set aside to pay it. The legislature is required, not only by law to contribute the nearly 90% the employee does not. When this was not being done so, a constitutional amendment was passed requiring it because the legislature was not doing so. They still aren't by the way and the money they do put in goes into a fund invested in the stock market which itself is extremely volatile.

The result is the pensions are paid regardless of the status of the investments on the basis, at least for teachers, at 2% per year times the average of the highest three years salary on reaching age 62. The average base salary for a teacher in Brunswick, for example is over $60,000 per year. and if retired with 40 years service will be paid about $48,000 per year in retirement, nearly one and a half times what it would cost to hire a new teacher, which they rarely do but rehire retirees because the union bosses who garner a percentage of the salaries in union dues would have to take a pay cut.

This system has been going on even before I moved to Maine but since coming here in 2000 the annual raises for the teachers has been in the neighborhood of 3%-4% per year and the number of teachers has not declined in proportion to the significant drop in school age children, particularly after the closing of the Brunswick Naval Air Station and the disappearance of nearly 20% of the school aged population. In fact the numbers have gone almost unchanged but the number of associated staff has increased significantly.

The same is true in the unionized workforce at Bath Ironworks, whose entire production is for the government. Like the teachers, if the work load requires or calls for a downsizing in staff, seniority prevails and those with the least seniority are the ones laid off, insuring the union coffers do not take a significant cut. Like the government workers, the military industrial complex is assured continued employment because the defense budget goes up every year. It was a laugh to read the State is going to continue but at a lower level the tax break it gives Bath Iron Works in order to stay competitive. Competitive with who. Their only competitor is in Louisiana and like BIW is kept afloat by government largess because not to do so would throw a lot of workers out of a job and those workers vote.

It should become obvious to even the least astute amongst us that this system is not sustainable when the population keeps increasing and the number of jobs does not, except for those subsidized by or in the government itself. The rise in the number of people actually unemployed has been camouflaged by the government for decades. This is true because the government, like not being able to count the number of illegal aliens in the country, hasn't the foggiest notion because they have no system that can accurately count them.

Melvin Udall
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Louisiana? Oops. Another

Louisiana? Oops. Another one.

What is the nature of the BIW "tax break?" Is it a cash payment from the state treasury?

Bruce Libby
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The Maine system is required

The Maine system is required to adhere to a pay back schedule (which can be adjusted)
and prohibits legislature from borrow from the system. That was what the constitutional amendment was all about.

pmconusa
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Just to make it clear, my

Just to make it clear, my minor error does not automatically make the rest of my argument false as you would like to intimate..

Bruce Libby
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pmconusa

pmconusa
Intimating nothing !

It is just intersting to see one such as you have to eat even a minor thing.

It makes up or most of your insulting manner.

Jasper
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Brucie, you're a thin-skinned

Brucie, you're a thin-skinned little man. To bad you can't make up for your insulting degradation of English.

Melvin Udall
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Hey, yesper. I think you

Hey, yesper. I think you meant "two bad," didn't ewe?

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